A question for the barbecue afficionados.

[theweaselking]

I have a barbecue. It is a piece of shit, and late last year it stopped lighting at all, and I did not care because it was late in the season and the barbecue is a piece of shit that was free when I got it.

This spring, I will replace my barbecue because it is a piece of shit and because even a piece of shit barbecue lets me barbecue things, and barbecued food is AWESOME.

I'm thinking I go to the local Canadian Tire[1] and buy the cheapest barbecue they have, on sale. Because I don't need a big one, or one with a rotisserie attachment, or anything like that, and as far as I know, I just need something with burners I can stick a propane tank on.

So my question is:

Am I missing something?
Is there some major benefit to shelling out a little extra cash and getting one of the Coleman(tm) "guaranteed even heat" barbecues instead of a Stick-Propane-In-It-And-Set-Fire Brand?
Is this one of those situations like the slow-cooker and the wok, where you can live with a crappy one but having a *good* one will open a hundred avenues of culinary experience of the type never before experienced by poor sad barbecueless me?

Because I'm thinking $100 seems like a high-but-potentially-workable price for one of the old-fashioned Stick-Propane-In-It-And-Set-Fire Brand barbecues, and that the major benefits of the more expensive models seems to be size (that I'm not needing) and the attachments (that I REALLY don't need).

[1]: People who are not Canadian should substitute "gargantuan hardware chain of your choice". Hardware box stores, like Wal-Mart if Wal-Mart sold reasonable-quality goods

Comments

[gilmoure.livejournal.com]

After finding an old Weber grill at the house we rented in college, and doing a lot of grilling on it, and then, years later, having my own house and getting a nice propane grill (present from Dad), I've gone back to the Weber. Now that I'm using one of their chimney starters, there's no problem with charcoal lighting, no fumes from lighter fluid or such and I get better BBQ out of it. Am on my second kettle (left first one in Fla) and my first Weber smoker. They're a little more expensive than the Char-broils that are sold everywhere but I think they're worth it. Hope this helps.

[rdmasters.livejournal.com]

Hear, hear!

Charcoal barbeques give you a *barbeque*, as opposed to outside cooking. In addition, there is very little to go wrong with them - the whole no gas fittings/moving parts bit.

They are a bit less impulsive, as it takes 20 minutes or so to get up to heat, but on the other hand, you can stockpile fuel without fear of gas-leaks or cylinders getting rusty.

And, yes, go for a Weber(tm) kettle. They give you multiple options for cooking (direct-grill, indirect roasting, heck - even baking (and nothing beats barbeque-baked bread)), are well-made, and *last*.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

Stockpiling: Not a big deal around here. Things going wrong: Yeah, my piece of shit that was unmaintained FOR YEARS by my dear former homeowner (http://theweaselking.livejournal.com/tag/dear%20former%20homeowner) finally broke, but that's the first time I've ever in my life seen a barbecue break.

Taking time to heat up: Yeah, bad.
Indirect roasting: Oh man, I should give you my chicken recipe. It'e fucking AWESOME. And works on my gas grill.

Advice given and not given:

[biomekanic.livejournal.com]

A friend of mine showed me years ago how to improve the performance of my coals:

Use a chimney: store bought, or made from one of those Costco cans of canned tomatoes. The manufactured chimneys are nice because they have handles and generally sturdier. This becomes important in the advice I am not giving you.

Load the chimney 1/2 full, and give it a few squirts of lighter fluid. Load it the rest of the way, and pour fluid on until you see a few drips come out of the bottom.

Wait 5 minutes, and repeat that process.

Wait another minute or two, and then light the charcoal from the bottom of the chimney.

I am now not advising you to do this:

Once the flames seem to get going okay, do not get a hair dryer, and using the 'air only no heat setting' on low blow air straight down the chimney like you are trying to smelt iron in a furnace.

Once you have a very respectable flame do not then turn the dryer so that the air is aimed at the bottom and now forcing the flame up through chimney.
You wish to avoid the fire coming out towards the handle, as if it is plastic, it can and will melt. Which makes it hard to grasp.

You should be aware that the 4' tall column of flame can alarm the neighbors who may ask if they need to call the fire department. Also, there should be nothing above the bbq when this is one.

I certainly don't advise using the hair dryer for anything other than it's intended purpose.*

*Unless it's a damn cold day and you're using it to warm your socks before putting them on. Then more power to you.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

I'm not a big fan of charcoal grills - I'm frankly impatient with the time it takes to get them to heat, and I mistrust any use of *fire* where I can't simply remove the fuel and let the heat wear off on it's own, because it requires too much monitoring before going safe.

So, I strongly favour GAS barbecues.

[kafziel.livejournal.com]

Do propane grills actually do that, though? Where they're heating a surface, which can hold residual heat once you cut the fuel? I thought they just applied fire directly to the meat, so once you turn the grill off things aren't gonna be getting more heat.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

In a charcoal grill, the charcoal can keep combusting, and you get more heat added until the fire goes realy and for true out.

In a gas grill, when the gas stops, the new heat stops and it's all residual from there.

[kafziel.livejournal.com]

Residual from what? The air? If there's no pan or other source for residual heat to enter the food, it's not getting residual heat.

Unless you mean the heat already in the food. Which is as simple as removing it from the grill and putting it on a plate under foil.

You can control the heat of a charcoal grill pretty easily just by limiting the oxygen supply though.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

.... residual as in "the barbecue is hot". The sides, the top, the grill. It's hot. It then leaks heat into the environment. It does not, however, get HOTTER.

On a gas grill, you cut of the gas, the temperature only goes down because *there is nothing adding temperature*. In a charcoal grill, you have fuel still being hot and doing hot-fuel things in there, for a while.

This is not "overcooking the food", this is "the fire wasn't out for HOURS, so the charcoal was all used up and the fence started smoldering".

[jerril]

This reply wasn't there when I hit post, I swear.

[jerril]

I think you're missing his point of fear. If I'm not projecting MY charcoal fear, it has nothing to do with "overcooking the food" and everything to do with "ZOMG FIRE". I much prefer my fire with an off button, which propane and/or natural gas gives you.


My mother has a natural gas barbecue, on the house gas line. Line gets checked every year along with the hot water tank and furnace, making it safer than the average propane tank in a shed.

[kafziel.livejournal.com]

A jug of water is your off button.

[torrain.livejournal.com]

For off buttons, I would rather more convenience then "yes let us haul out the jug or turn the hose on the barbecue because we are absolutely sure that gushing water won't ever move hot bits to where we do not want them (even when wielded by a clumsy person (me)), and we are *also* absolutely sure that we will never want to cook a second round/course/meal before it becomes convenient to remove the wet charcoal and start over. Which is less convenient then using gas anyway."

...the little clicky dial on the side of the gas barbecue is looking more appealing every minute, I swear.

(Plus fire is not ever to be left unattended until it is out because fuel is no longer being consumed, and the back yard is not always that interesting a place to wait around. Lacks a convenient power outlet, and my laptop battery bleeds out really quickly. Yes, the water jug fixes this, but as outlined above--inconvenient.)

[nsanity-au.livejournal.com]

You're not supposed to keep propane tanks in a shed.

Infact in Australia, having pressurised flammable gases indoors (it might even be under cover), without a license and gas cupboard is both illegal and your insurance is void.

The reason why you don't fill up propane tanks anymore, but swap them, is this way seals are better checked (as they are checked when filled by the gas company) and in better condition.

I also believe pressure vessels for flammable gases/liquids are only allowed to be 5 years old (not sure on this one).

[fridgepunk.livejournal.com]

Australia doesn't have weather or mooses (miice?) though, so keeping all your explosives readily accessible to the weather and mooses is not a good idea outside of tropical locales (I.e. it's more dangerous than keeping it indoors, also how the hell do science departments work in australia? Are the gas taps in open air labs? Not that that doesn't sound nice, it'd be well fumigated certainly...)

[nsanity-au.livejournal.com]

Gas Cupboards are vented externally to the atmosphere.

And WTF? Moose eat Propane Gas Cylinders?

Actually I can't deal with this.

Its cold in canada. If i chill a gas canister. The gas condenses, taking less room.

Also

Moose Eat metal gas canisters?

My head hurts.

I'm learning more than i ever wanted to know about Canada...

[fridgepunk.livejournal.com]

Moose ate bullwinkle.

Moose ate the correct pluralisation of their own name.

Moose eat EVERYTHING.

[nsanity-au.livejournal.com]

So they are like the Frozen Equivalent of Goats?

Also when a Moose eats a Propane Gas Cylinders do they Explode? Do Canadians have a legitimate problem with Exploding mooses?

(My friend thinks the plural is meece, based on Mouse, Mice. or something. I'm not overly convinced.)

pluralim

[dglenn.livejournal.com]

More likely from goose->geese.

Re: pluralim

[nsanity-au.livejournal.com]

I put this to her, no, not like goose -> geese. She's standing by Mouse->Mice.

Your logic is far superior however.

[fridgepunk.livejournal.com]

Pretty much Dire Ice Goats. At higher levels they have frost attacks, though if a moose eats a propane tank and then someone having a smoke they can use a fire based breath weapon.

This is why Canada is considering banning outdoors smoking.

[nsanity-au.livejournal.com]

I'm concerned.

I always thought Canada was far safer than the US. I am beginning to have second thoughts.

[alchemist.livejournal.com]

I'm ok with charcoal, but it is a pain if you want a burger to do the startup and shutdown required.

For quick stuff, gas is golden. But if I'm looking for that particular flavor you can only get from, say, mesquite, charcoal is it.

[argonel.livejournal.com]

I would look at the quality of the grids and maintence required to keep food from sticking to them. Other than that not a lot of difference in my opinion. You have fire, you have meat, combine the two and you end up with deliciousness.

[zenandtheart.livejournal.com]

I quite like uneven heat on a bbq plate as it lets me keep things that are already cooked warm while cooking other things quickly.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

That's what the hanging-way-off-the-grill basket is for, in theory.

[hawkhandsaw.livejournal.com]

While I agree charcoal does produce a better tasting grilled meat, I too want the instant properties of gas. I have always bought the under $100 grill that rusts out in three or four years. Occasionally I replace the burner when it turns from lots of even holes for the flame to go through into a few long ovals that help burn meat instead grill it. My dad and brother-in-law have bought the more expensive stainless steel grills that cost $500 and up. They do last much longer and they are bigger. I just went to go buy two replacement parts for the grill we bought five years ago, a new burner and the part that directs the dripping grease away from the flame. The two parts together cost $55 and a new grill cost me $67.

[scixual.livejournal.com]

A good grill will last longer.

It is not necessarily the same as an expensive grill. Coleman has a good reputation.

And when a gas-powered appliance goes bad, there is a chance it will go bad badly, so I'd opt for a bit of research and getting the sturdiest, best-reviewed in your price range.

[vonpookie.livejournal.com]

My husband has been lusting after this for a while now, and bought one yesterday:

http://www.biggreenegg.com/

It's charcoal, and we used it for the first time last night. It cooked 3 ribeye steaks in about 4 minutes flat, and got up to 400 or so degrees in maybe 10 or so.

Thing was FAST. And steak was mighty tasty.

[lonebear.livejournal.com]

a decent-passable multi burner grill will give you much better control of your temperature zones. I chose cast iron grill surface as it holds the heat nice and actually seasons. And boy does it leave pretty grill marks on my steaks.

rdmasters: I'm confused. What do you mean with the difference between "barbeque as opposed to outside cooking".

There is no flame directly on anything on any grill I have ever owned. The burners have plates over them to even out the heat. I can turn the burners on one side low, put my meat of choice on the other side, and slow cook for hours.

[alchemist.livejournal.com]

If managed properly, you can get a nice flame-sear from the fat or juices of the meat in question. Sure, it requires a but more attention & control, but man, done right, you get some GREAT flavor.

[rdmasters.livejournal.com]

Ah - I am not referring to how a piece of meat is finished - that would be 'cooked on the outside' as opposed to 'outside cooking'.

Barbequing to my personal understanding involves the presence of:
a) Actual flame (direct contact with meal optional)
b) Some degree of smoke - even a well set wood or charcoal fire will produce a small amount of smoke - to flavour the meal

Outside cooking is the use of any means of cooking in an outside environment - gas hotplates, gas grills, barbeques, outside ovens, smokers, etc...

One is a special case of the other. I suppose you could use 'outdoors cooking' if you wanted to avoid any possible misunderstanding of that nature, but to me that phrase would carry more of a wilderness connotation.

[alchemist.livejournal.com]

I'm posting this blind, having not read any comments yet, so if it's a bit redundant, that's why.

I have what is basically a "throw-propane-in-it" variety. It has four burners inside and a fifth on the outside that looks like a traditional gas stove. It's also stainless and all-weather, since it lives outside and covers have been a waste for me.

This is fine for me. I cook for 2-20 people on it, and use as many burners as I need (including the side one for heating a pot of say, chili or kraut).

The only reason I did the big-price tag (this was 350+USD) was for (a) size, and (b) all-weather. The honest truth is, good grilling[1] is about the cook, and not the tools. Honestly, I can do the same things on a $100 Coleman as my $350 Kenmore. It came down to size and knowing that this one will last me about at least 15-20 years with proper maintenance.

[1] Dwn here, "barbecue" is a noun referring to the food, and the device you are looking for is a "grill."

[fridgepunk.livejournal.com]

You'd think someone would have invented an outdoor microwave, maybe a box with a lasing material in the top.

Failing that: real-life Euclid's C-Finder.

[reyl.livejournal.com]

If you have propane or natural gas lines at your house for other reasons, you can actually have a nice barbeque hooked up to the house line. So you Never Run Out Of Gas. This is insanely cool, since propane tanks are cumbersome.

I loathe charcoal for the same reasons you do btw. I don't want every burger night to be an event. I don't want to have to babysit my food fire all night. Considering how awesome burgers and sausage are, and how inclement our weather can get, sometimes I just want to run outside and flip the food with an umbrella, ya know?

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

I don't actually mind the tanks, and the idea of an exposed gas line semi-attached to a solid object that can move around and tip over worries me. An attached tank goes WITH the barbecue with no stretching or twisting, and any leak its limited to the amount that was left in the tank.

(Which is still a lot, if the tank was full! It's just not "all of it", like the house supply.)

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

*boggles at BBQ* I have a kitchen full of modern appliances and have no idea why anyone would like to light a fire and cook meat over it like it was the 16th century :)

BUT if you're going to BBQ, then BBQ - really people who get these BBQs with rotisseries and hotplates et al just have a small portable kitchen in the garden, it's silly it is

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

Because you can't do steak, sausages, hamburgers, or kabobs *properly* in a standard kitchen. They can be made more or less depending on the meal, but never turn out perfectly.

And while you can totally cook a chicken in an oven, cooking one on a grill gives amazingly nice results.

[cleodhna.livejournal.com]

Also because there are certain things you don't want to cook in the house. Sardines are a good example. Sardines are freaking delicious, good for you, and cheap, but man, do they stink up the house.

Also, may I have your chicken recipe? 'Cuz barbecued food is awesome and I am always interested in recipes that are fucking AWESOME. I'll give you my sardine recipe.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

The chicken recipe is surprisingly simple: Take a chicken, stuff with Things (I use onions and lemons and Generic Babecue Spice From A Package), rub the skin with a little olive oil, salt, and a PILE of the same barbecue spice, cover, and let sit in the fridge for a few hours to let the spices sink in.

Outside: Light the barbecue and let it heat up. turn off half the barbecue, and put the chicken on the turned-off half. Leave the other half on Medium. Close the lid, wait about an hour.

As for the sardines recipe: No thanks, I'll skip that. I'm not fond of fish at the best of times, and sardines are not that.

[cleodhna.livejournal.com]

Thank you! Do you leave the skin on? I'll have to make investigations into Generic Barbecue Spice from a Package, but that looks seriously nice. I'll have to investigate barbecues with lids, too. We use a thing that is basically half a can on legs.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

I do leave the skin on, and the Generic Barbecue Spice From A Package is generally found in little packets hanging from the dividers of the meat counter of the local grocery store.

(I will also note that simply purchasing a pre-cooked chicken from the grocery store is actually usually CHEAPER - I can't *make* a roasted chicken for $6.99, even leaving aside my time and effort cooking, and that's the price tag on the hot roasted chickens near the deli counter.)

[cleodhna.livejournal.com]

Cheaper, maybe, but a lot less fun. I had an *excellent* barbecue spice mix once, but alas, the ingredients were all in French, so I don't know what was in it, and the store stopped selling it. I sense research in my future.

[ice-hesitant.livejournal.com]

We got a cheap barbecue at an end-of-season sale at Sears a couple years back. It's awesome. IMHO, the most important thing in a barbecue is the ability for it to get really, really hot.

[ice-hesitant.livejournal.com]

For the record, I don't slowcook. I mostly do steaks (6 minutes to done) and lambchops (8 minutes to done).

Burgers are yummy too. Chicken is possible, but it tends to leak a lot of flammable fluid, so I usually do it in the oven.

[theweaselking.livejournal.com]

Leaking flammable fluid is what barbecues are FOR!

[kelvin n nishikawa (from livejournal.com)]

Try science. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGKSdQJrIWY

short version:
Line your el cheapo grill with aluminum foil, shiny-side in. Also, make sure the fat drips on to the burning coals.

[ardys-the-ghoul.livejournal.com]

I always thought having a massively expensive grill was one of those symbols of manliness, like a sportscar. It never occurred to me that they might actually be worth the cash.

It has been years since my family has owned a grill of any kind. Any cooking outdoors usually involves spearing something on a stick and holding it over an open fire.